These days I train with pretty large volume, integrating some heavy low rep stuff with a lot of super-sets and some drop sets.

When it comes to training my legs, i have no problem doing all kinds of squats (normal, front, overhead, split, etc...) and doing various leg press machines and curls and extensions and calves and what not....

On my deadlift day, I would like to be able to do my deadlifts, then hit some more legs as well has maybe some shrugs and shit.

Yesterdays deadlift day was rough though...did 5x5 heavy. Then did 1 set of 30 reps with 250lbs as fast as possible without ever re-gripping...This set killed me. When I max out on bench or shoulder press or squats or anything else, i can continue on to do a solid workout. Maxing out on deadlift left me incapacitated laying on a bench for about 20 miunutes and all i could do was a few shrugs before I left the gym light headed.

Anyone else have this problem? Not sure what to do, cause id really like to be able to hit my legs harder on the dead lift days. not feeling very sore today but had no ability to keep going...

Originally Posted by NomZ

No.

it was weird, fucked with my plan for the week cause i intended to destroy my legs yesterday but instead my glutes are a little sore and my hammies are a little sore.

so then the concesus is stop being a pussy and lift? lol

Originally Posted by NomZ

In all seriousness, just got to get up to that conditioning level and accept lower back is slow to recover.

I have no problem doing 15 rep sets with ~400, then going on to heavier work.

damn, yeah itll just take time i guess. It wasnt even muscle exhaustion, it was my head. I was on the verge of passing out even though i repped out 30 reps pretty easy.

Originally Posted by NomZ

I was pretty close to blacking out after the 15 rep set, then worked up to a heavy deficit single.

yeah i saw the vids. very impressive. I need that kind of endurance with deads. Best way to get there is just more deads right? lol

Never do I have this problem, but I can see why you would be exhausted. Deadlifts are a whole-body movement/exercise and moving a shit load of weight for 1 max rep or a few strenuous reps -it's going to destroy you in many ways as you're contracting/using nearly every muscle in some way to exert an enormous amount of energy to move a stationary mass.

But a question, are you doing deadlifts a day before your leg day? Whats your split?

Originally Posted by J2jud

Never do I have this problem, but I can see why you would be exhausted. Deadlifts are a whole-body movement/exercise and moving a shit load of weight for 1 max rep or a few strenuous reps -it's going to destroy you in many ways as you're contracting/using nearly every muscle in some way to exert an enormous amount of energy to move a stationary mass.

But a question, are you doing deadlifts a day before your leg day? Whats your split?

No, I hit legs twice a week. My split changes, because my lifestyle changes and requires tuning the schedule a bit. But it usually looks something like this:
1. Chest/bis/abs
2. back/tris/abs
3. legs
4. shoulders/traps/abs...some lighter arms too
5. rest
6. legs/deadlifts/traps
7. rest

sometimes it changes though and im doing oly lifts or something.

I also still go running.

Basically what im getting at is yesterday i was on number 6, and i did the deadlifts first, and couldnt finish my work out cause i was too fucked up... My deadlifts went well, my lower back is sore, traps are sore, and my glutes and hams are a little bit sore. What I want to be able to do, is continue on to destroy my legs more. Waking up after day 3, i can hardly walk. I want the same out of day 6, but my stamina wouldnt allow me to go long enough to get there.

Originally Posted by rob415

No, I hit legs twice a week. My split changes, because my lifestyle changes and requires tuning the schedule a bit. But it usually looks something like this:
1. Chest/bis/abs
2. back/tris/abs
3. legs
4. shoulders/traps/abs...some lighter arms too
5. rest
6. legs/deadlifts/traps
7. rest

sometimes it changes though and im doing oly lifts or something.

I also still go running.

Basically what im getting at is yesterday i was on number 6, and i did the deadlifts first, and couldnt finish my work out cause i was too fucked up... My deadlifts went well, my lower back is sore, traps are sore, and my glutes and hams are a little bit sore. What I want to be able to do, is continue on to destroy my legs more. Waking up after day 3, i can hardly walk. I want the same out of day 6, but my stamina wouldnt allow me to go long enough to get there.

Ok, good detail.

I don't see any real problems with your set-up other than you have a block of days where you're constantly putting stress on your lower back and back, in general on (# -2/3/4) and then are only getting a days rest before hitting some back and legs again. It's possible that you might not be getting adequate rest or are just plain not recovering fast enough. Possibilities are great. Given that you said you're adding in more volume, it may require some more rest days or workout split changes.

If you've just started this routine/training style as of recent (3-6 weeks), I might hypothesize that you're just not used to the routine and training style just yet - providing you can exclude recovery issues - suggesting that the problem may just be an excessive amount of lactic acid and lack of rest a probability.

However, if you've been at this routine/training style long enough and it is an issue of recovery, I might insinuate that you need to change your routine in order to work your legs and back so that you're recovering. You'd also want to add in some extra cals from protein/fat. You already know.

A third scenario may be that your legs take a longer time-frame to recover than you're allowing and you may need to change the order in which you hit specific muscle groups. A fourth may be that you just need to add some more calories.

Truth is, there is no clear answer except to try and change so you can accomplish your primary goal.

yeah i started lifting again seriously about 6 weeks ago. Before that I was still mainly running for the USMC and shit, but theres a long story behind whats going on there...basically need to do some other stuff for a couple years before I can pursue my dreams of the military. So in the meantime im lifting heavy and hard again and not doing as much running/rucking/calisthenics.

So to answer the question, it is a fairly new routine. In the past, rest has been an issue and i have actually done 8 day splits before. Im not married to the idea of doing a specific workout on a specific day of the week. So 8 day splits with a total of 3 days of rest may be best for me. Ill experiment around, thanks for the input

Originally Posted by Warrior

Not to ruin a deep conversation but... A lot of people just don't breathe enough on deads. A lot of straining not enough breathing. And the position can make breathing the whole time awkward. But exhaustion with minimal soreness imo is typically just a lack of oxygen in my experience.

whether or not its the main problem, i guarrentee you that im not breathing right. I catch my self holding my breathe sometimes... and i bet a 30 rep set with shitty breathing would lay me out.... really good point, ill try to be concious of that next time.

Originally Posted by rob415

whether or not its the main problem, i guarrentee you that im not breathing right. I catch my self holding my breathe sometimes... and i bet a 30 rep set with shitty breathing would lay me out.... really good point, ill try to be concious of that next time.

It's hard considering your stomach is pushed out to support your back, and you cannot breathe through the shoulders because the weight is pulling. If the shoulder blade spread/flatness and the shoulders slightly up during the deads is held perfect, it should help. In your deepest breaths even through the stomach, the shoulders and back lift and expand almost like a Minut lat spread... And I think under perfect conditions your deadlift should be held in a position where the lats are flat across with the shoulders anyway.

Take a deep breath with your arms held down and feel how your back flattens and your lats expand.... I think that is also perfect deadlift position. Maybe that is part of the reason why.

Originally Posted by Warrior

Not to ruin a deep conversation but... A lot of people just don't breathe enough on deads. A lot of straining not enough breathing. And the position can make breathing the whole time awkward. But exhaustion with minimal soreness imo is typically just a lack of oxygen in my experience.

I'll do up to 5-6 reps on a single breath, and that's not just with warm up weight.

am i the only one who see's that kind of volume on deads pointless?

Originally Posted by TRex

In b4 overtraining disease Nomz got

I wasn't really deadlifting, dat der smolov squats.

Originally Posted by rob415

yeah i started lifting again seriously about 6 weeks ago. Before that I was still mainly running for the USMC and shit, but theres a long story behind whats going on there...basically need to do some other stuff for a couple years before I can pursue my dreams of the military. So in the meantime im lifting heavy and hard again and not doing as much running/rucking/calisthenics.

So to answer the question, it is a fairly new routine. In the past, rest has been an issue and i have actually done 8 day splits before. Im married to the idea of doing a specific workout on a specific day of the week. So 8 day splits with a total of 3 days of rest may be best for me. Ill experiment around, thanks for the input

No problem, Rob. I hope you can get to the root of the problem before too long.

Originally Posted by Pansori

am i the only one who see's that kind of volume on deads pointless?

what do you mean? the 30 rep set? or you mean my desire to do a bunch more legs after my deadlifts?

Originally Posted by J2jud

No problem, Rob. I hope you can get to the root of the problem before too long.

i just edited a typo in that post. i meant to say that i was NOT married to the idea of a specific workout on the same day of the week each week. In other words saying i would consider an 8 day split. How do you feel about that idea to get some more rest in there? adding in a extra day of rest after the shoulder day maybe?

Originally Posted by rob415

what do you mean? the 30 rep set? or you mean my desire to do a bunch more legs after my deadlifts?

30 rep set was what i was referring to. No hate, just curious.